Summary
Israeli Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich endorsed President-elect Donald Trump’s victory, stating it’s “time” to extend full Israeli sovereignty over the occupied West Bank.
This comes as Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu highlighted his alignment with Trump on the “Iranian threat.”
Tensions in Gaza and Lebanon have escalated following recent Israeli airstrikes, with regional leaders gathering in Riyadh to address Israeli actions.
Israeli President Isaac Herzog is set to meet President Biden, though Biden’s influence on Israel may be limited following Trump’s win.
Who could have predicted this???
Every UN country except Israel & the US.
No they knew too, just were ok with it.
Me 🧙
bUt hArRiS sUpPoRtS gEnOcIdE
Both can be true, that she supports genocide but that Trump will be worse.
I really hated all the moaning about people calling out that both are shitty options. The Overton window is so far to the right. Like, yeah Harris is clearly the better option but neither represent any positive moves forward.
For Palestine? Probably. In so many other options? It’s laughable that people think that the two candidates were in any way similar.
Biden, and by extension Harris, have not waved their hands and saved the country (even if they could, which they can’t, because we elected politicians not magicians), but they have done leagues more for people than anything the Trump crowd has.
Being ignorant of that is dangerous, but spreading that ignorance is borderline manslaughter for all the people who are going to be hurt because millions of people decided not to show up for this election that did for the last.
The Harris campaign made the decision to not break from Biden on Israel, at the cost of a +6 points gain. That’s the fault of the campaign’s calculations to ignore those voters, take them for granted, and instead run to the right with Liz Cheney and having the most lethal Military.
I voted for Harris and told others to do the same. It’s still on the campaign. Blaming voters is just sowing division when we need unity and solidarity to fight against Fascism.
Quote
Our first matchup tested a Democrat and a Republican who “both agree with Israel’s current approach to the conflict in Gaza”. In this case, the generic candidates tied 44–44. The second matchup saw the same Republican facing a Democrat supporting “an immediate ceasefire and a halt of military aid and arms sales to Israel”. Interestingly, the Democrat led 49–43, with Independents and 2020 non-voters driving the bulk of this shift.
- Split Ticket (July 2024)
Quotes
In Pennsylvania, 34% of respondents said they would be more likely to vote for the Democratic nominee if the nominee vowed to withhold weapons to Israel, compared to 7% who said they would be less likely. The rest said it would make no difference. In Arizona, 35% said they’d be more likely, while 5% would be less likely. And in Georgia, 39% said they’d be more likely, also compared to 5% who would be less likely.
- New Poll Suggests Gaza Ceasefire and Arms Embargo Would Help Dems with Swing State Voters (Full YouGov Report) (May 2024)
Quotes
- Data For Progress Poll (May 2024)
Quotes
Quotes
Majorities of Democrats (67%) and Independents (55%) believe the US should either end support for Israel’s war effort or make that support conditional on a ceasefire. Only 8% of Democrats but 42% of Republicans think the US must support Israel unconditionally.
Republicans and Independents most often point to immigration as one of Biden’s top foreign policy failures. Democrats most often select the US response to the war in Gaza.
There’s no one issue that, independently, could have change the outcome that no other could have as well. Blaming it on just one thing is just as ignorant as blaming it just on voters.
It’s as much on the Harris campaign as the American people who didn’t fucking show up, despite all the evidence that it’s going to be so much worse with Trump.
Trying to say “It’s anyone’s fault but mine” at this stage is pointless, though… because what’s done is done. We’re fucked. Doing nothing but point fingers only damages us in the long run, because it’s that much more energy not spent on fixing it in the future.
I agree that pointing blame is not useful. Understanding the reasons for why voter output for the Democratic Party was depressed by over 10 million voters is in order to find a path forward.
It’s ultimately on the campaign to earn those votes, they failed to with their campaign strategy. People are being squeezed with high costs of living and low wages. Business as usual is not appealing to people who want real change. The data is clear that progressive policies are popular with everyone, that includes Republicans and independents on top of Democrats. The decision to take those voters for Granted without offering them enough on the policy front, and instead move to the right, was a calculated decision by the campaign that failed. Instead, the campaign could have ran boldly on progressive policies. Especially with the Walz pick. They could have hemorrhaged the Republican base by running on policies that will improve their lives too. Such as universal healthcare, affordable public housing / housing first, increasing federal minimum wage and eliminating subminimum wage, free collage, etc. Her policy of taking on Price gouging was great, we needed a lot more of that and a lot less of things like moving to the right on immigration while campaigning with Liz Cheney.
Polls on campaign messaging
How to Win a Swing Voter in Seven Days
“The View” Alternate Universe: Break From Biden in Interviews, Play the Hits in Ads
Polls on policy
How Trump and Harris Voters See America’s Role in the World
Majority of Americans support progressive policies such as higher minimum wage, free college
Democrats should run on the popular progressive ideas, but not the unpopular ones
Here Are 7 ‘Left Wing’ Ideas (Almost) All Americans Can Get Behind
Finding common ground: 109 national policy proposals with bipartisan support
Progressive Policies Are Popular Policies
Tim Walz’s Progressive Policies Popular With Republicans in Swing States
I see a lot of people preferring to blame voter demographics over recognizing how the Campaign failed to earn those votes. Now more than ever we need solidarity to protect ourselves and our communities from this rise in Fascism.
With Harris you had someone at least you could work with, she reacts and actually suffers political damage. Trump doesn’t give a single shit what anyone wants and gets away with everything.
Over 50% of the god damn country voted for a man who has so many major, should-be career ending flaws we don’t even need to list them anymore. If he kicked a puppy it wouldn’t even make the top 10 worst things he’s done. The democrats lost to the stupidest president of all time, a man who’s entire economic policy revolves around tariffs that he fundamentally doesn’t even understand and who cannot seem to open his mouth without lying.
…and you’re here dunking on the people trying to oppose America’s blatant complicity in genocide. Well, you sure showed them.
Tbf the 50% that voted for trump aren’t here, plain and simple, so that’s why you don’t see engagement with them.
The only political engagement you’ll see here on Lemmy shifts overwhelmingly left for all parties, so you’ll see mostly squabbling between various left factions.
For some reason they still think they can bully people into voting for their guy. This has been thoroughly disproved but still they persist.
while youre busy opposing genocide, you got someone significantly worse elected instead. Well done.
Why do so many “moderates” insist on acting like the politically engaged people they run into online are the same people who are were so politically disengaged this year that they just didn’t vote?
Like, could you please explain the thinking that someone wouldn’t vote and then keep spending free time talking about it?
It’s not just you, and you’re not the first one I asked.
But everyone else just down votes me for asking and never respond.
Well here’s a comment from someone I was talking to that was politically engaged yet arguing that folks might as well not vote.
I’m not going into the thinking behind it, but it’s certainly happening.
Being politically “engaged” on Lemmy doesn’t mean much in terms of ensuring voter participation. I’ve seen plenty of folks with a “democrats have to earn my vote” sentiment. That very much seemed to play out given the much lower voter participation for Democrats this year.
Did you link the wrong comment?
What you linked is just someone saying they can understand why someone who thinks both party’s won’t help, won’t be likely to vote.
someone who thinks both party’s won’t help
I don’t read it this way all - there was no conditional on party efficacy and it in fact was an assertion that their lives won’t change due to who was elected, which changed the overall statement to read like the working class shouldn’t vote.
So, the issue is you’re not understanding what people are saying…
You’re thinking they said something they didn’t and you’re getting upset about nothing.
Probably for the same reason so many terminally online “politically engaged” people insist that they’re clearly morally and intellectually superior to everyone else despite the fact that all they do is whine about how the “lesser evil” (in just one of thousands of elections, no less) isn’t good enough for them.
Maybe if you stopped focusing so much on the negatives, and started promoting positive change, people wouldn’t argue with you so much.
I think you’re confusing me for someone else
I voted D like I always do, so have most progressive on here from what I’ve seen them say.
What me, and them, have been saying is that Biden and Harris had our votes, but every indication show d they wouldn’t get enough to beat trump.
It’s fine to be upset about that, we are too. Probably more than any moderate, we’re literally losing more than you all, that’s why we care.
But what’s scary is this has all happened before. Moderates refuse to acknowledge they’re unpopular with Dem voters, and rather than reach out to progressives for help reaching non-votera…
You all just seemed obsessed with turning more Dem voters away from the party.
Maybe if you stopped focusing so much on the negatives, and started promoting positive change, people wouldn’t argue with you so much.
The change we need is better Dem candidates, how the absolute fuck will that happen if we’re not allowed to acknowledge we keep running shitty candidates?
Do you even remember how a fair and open primary is supposed to work?
How is one of those ever possible if no one is allowed to criticize the party’s favorite?
I really didn’t.
She does, so does Biden, just not to the extent trump will.
It’s fucked up the DNC insisted on taking support of genocide as a binary topic out of this election.
Just think, if they cared more about votes than dark money from a foreign government, trump might not be president elect right now. That was always an option you know? Giving Dem voters what they wanted, not just on this issues but multiple others.
Do you think the gamble was worth it now?
Are you willing to do anything different in four years?
These people will blame us for the next 4 years and then blame us when the next neoliberal party darling loses in 2028. Anything they can do to deflect responsibility, hold anyone accountable, and prevent disrupting the status quo in this great race to the bottom.
Biden and Harris already openly pledge unconditional material support to Israel in its genocide, organize Europe in this same direction, and go after anyone opposing them on this. Israel receives what it materially needs to do all pf this. Any further escalation in the West Bank will be done with materials, funds, and diplomatic cover provided by the Biden-Harris administration.
Biden and Harris feign empathy and try to run little games around redefining what a ceasefire is for PR purposes. But in terms of the basic reakity of supporting Israel to do whatever it wants to Palestinians, as in providing them the means they would otherwise nit have to do it, there is no sense in which they are less bad than Trump.
There’s a lot of stupidity reflected in these elections.
I’ve said before (and will say again) that US elections are like our national-scale county fairs: idiots that your normally never see come out of the woodwork.
Yes she does
Harris did and does support genocide and if you tolerated that you should do some self-criticism.
I remember commenting a couple months back on one of those “Arab-Americans not voting for Harris” posts, something along the lines of “it’s your vote, but I think that you’re going to find that you’d rather have Harris than Trump” and listing some past policy moves like the embassy in Jerusalem, and then someone downvoting and responding something along the lines of “identical candidates”.
I’ll bet you anything that that user hasn’t posted anything in almost a week. Just a hunch.
I’ve absolutely still seen people making those arguments. It’s fuckin’ wild.
If you bring it up to them now they get PISSED
And I think you will find that there has been no material difference in what “Israel” is actually doing. They’ve been ramping up occupation and violence in the West Bank for months, going in exactly this direction already. They murdered an American activist in the West Bank as part of this and swept it under the rug using the pretense of an “investigation”, remember? The West Bank is already occupied, it is already split into isolated districts, travel is already highly restricted, there are racist curfews for those who must commute to work in Israel, forced through several checkpoints and fearing jail for any delays, giving themselves 3 hour buffers for travel tine, and their government is compradors that work with the IOF to arrest and jail them and out down resistance movements.
The main difference between Dems and GOP on Israel is that Dems feign empathy and concern while Republicans are openly racist. But materially the outcomes are actually very similar, with Dems often being worse because they can more effectively count on your lack of dissent and in coordinating with Europe.
You might remember that there has been a US-backed genocide in Gaza for over a year, under a Dem, and they were willing to lose the election rather than stop supporting genocide.
So Arab Americans will come crawling back after the Trump administration
I remember a couple months back when Kamala Harris swapped in for Joe Biden and her popularity peaked through the fucking roof when people thought she was going to stop the genocide.
Then Kamala said she was going to continue the genocide and kicked Palestinians out of the DNC.
Removed by mod
Lol. Imagine making a reductive statement to a vastly complicated topic to try and sound smart only to reveal how little you understand. On the internet no less!
They’re emotional but they’re also correct. Israel controls the West Bank in all but name already.
people don’t even bother checking what israel has been for the last year and then make statement “democrat would be better”. Israel with AIPAC own the US. They democrats government couldn’t even say ceasefire nor did Canada, France, or Germany. Democrat and Republic has different approach to China and Russia and maybe Iran, but Palestinian ? there is no way democrat would stop anything.
“Complicated topic”
Removed by mod
Anyone who abstained on grounds of Harris’s position on Gaza in my view have blood on their hands in what will not only assuredly he worse for Palestinians under Trump, but also the ongoing attempted genocide in Ukraine by Putin.
They may as well be Trump voters to me and I want nothing to do with them.
Worse than Trump voters actually. The vast majority of Trump voters have convinced themselves that what they’re doing is good, actually, and that the democrats are evil whereas the people who abstained from voting for Harris literally had a choice of a candidate that campaigned on making their number one issue worse, and one that at least attempted to talk about peace deals and decided to just have no impact whatsoever, condemning hundreds of thousands plus to certain death. They claim to be on the side of ending human suffering when in actuality, they’re little piss babies that are upset that their 10% of the population doesn’t have complete and total control.
Most of the people spreading that bullshit here were .ml tankies and probably wanted trump elected anyway.
LeopardsAteMyFace.
Unfortunately, this time around, for the Americans pretending to actually give damn on social meda, Gaza will be a parking lot soon.
Just as Trump proclaimed.
Gaza is a parking lot already.
All Trump will do is officially move the border line. The full ethnic cleansing of North Gaza is taking place under Biden this very moment.
Wait, why would it make any difference if Donald is elected?
I thought everyone was saying that Biden and Harris were doing nothing about the Palestinians.
They said they wanted a two state solution. Trump has always been a burn it to the ground guy on that topic.
Biden is Kamala’s boss, so she toes his line while VP, that’s how the job usually works, unless you’re Cheney.
So playing the odds at least there’s a chance of survival with Kamala. With Trump it’s just nuked, but without actual nukes.
But hey, Kamala wasn’t good enough so let’s go with the nukes👍
Once again, human spite has the force to move mountains.
“We did it, Patrick! We saved Palestine!”
“Our strategy failed and our candidate lost. Quick! Start mocking people for caring about a genocide before they start getting ideas about blaming us for the mess we caused!”
“Dems ran a shit out-of-touch campaign, obviously this absolves all of us who were beating the ‘Don’t vote against the fascist’ drum as hard as we could.”
Believe it or not, and I understand this is quite unsettling for people with a simplistic view of the world, blame can be shared over multiple parties. Yes, really!
It sounds like you’re still running their campaign for them as you gain enjoyment by mocking those opposed to supporters and enablers of genocide regardless of which tribe they belong to. That was a conscious choice from her, and this is a conscious choice from you to continue your support. She was trying to win an election, but what’s your excuse?
Please scour through my post history and find where I’ve ever told anyone how they should vote.
She was trying to win an election, but what’s your excuse?
Trying to avoid additional genocides here at home, and being rightfully upset that me, my friends, and loved ones are now in the sights of genocide in addition to the Palestinian genocide getting worse and Ukrainian genocide being enabled by Trump and a potential invasion of Taiwan by the CCP?
I guess that’s all small stuff compared to virtue signaling over Palestine. Gotta maintain that spiritual attitude towards politics.
Please scour through my post history and find where I’ve ever told anyone how they should vote.
I don’t know if you, personally, were banging the don’t vote drum, and expressed no opinion on whether YOU were or not. You have, however, jumped in on a comment mocking those who thought that abstaining was in any way a moral choice and saw fit to equate that to ‘mocking people for caring about genocide’.
A shitty campaign does not excuse you from sitting back and allowing fascism to take over. You share in the blame.
A shitty campaign does not excuse you from sitting back and allowing fascism to take over.
I did no such thing. I place the blame on Trump voters, Harris, and the DNC
I wonder if you ever admit fault or if it’s always someone else.
That finance minister is a Kahanist (Israeli fascist), he doesn’t just want to annex parts of the west bank. He wants to annex all of the west bank and Gaza while renaming both. As someone living in Israel I’ve seen how people are already calling the west bank “Judea and Sumera”. He also wants to kill all Arabs and Muslims.
Abstention was already ok with this
Abstention in Michigan had no faith the Democrats would prevent this.
Cuz they kept saying they wouldn’t
Israel is already controlling the West bank directly with settlements and indirectly with the Palestinians authority who arrest resistance leaders but do nothing to defend Palestinians
Fucking war criminals
Brought to you in part by the voters too stupid to see the WWarmongering and accelerated genocide and the others who think it’s a good thing, prophecy, or that billions won’t die because idiot bullies have the bombs.
We appreciate that you come together in support of the War even with having to plan your intertwined economy failing and dragging down others, dollar replaced, rights removals, and climate fails. /s
The genocide is already accelerated. The Biden-Harris administration already gives Israel all of the material, military, and diplomatic support they need for genociding Gaza and ramping up against the West Bank, the latter being something that has already been happening for months. And people like yourself tolerated that, accepted that from “your” candidates, and fought against those for whom it was correctly a red line.
In short, both Biden and Harris would rather lose than be anything other than 100% materially supportive of Israel’s genocide. They made that choice and y’all backed them up on it. Time to own those decisions, the decision to lose in support of genocide, and do some self-criticism around how what you subscribed to was actually neither particularly strategic nor morally sound.
“Accelerated genocide” is a term that fits along nicely with “enhanced interrogation.” It’s good to see the right-wing disinformation machine is still functioning since W. Bush left office. I wonder if Harris picked that gem up as she was courting Dick Cheney’s endorsement?
Are you actually suggesting genocide can’t get worse once it’s already genocide? If so, you know absolutely nothing about genocide.
Do you honestly think this is a winning argument as if those are the only two options?
Those literally were the only two options. It’s a two-party system. Sorry.
Genocide and genocide? How about xenophobia and xenophobia? Pro-corporate anti-worker and pro-corporate anti-worker? We may be limited on parties, but they decide their platforms.
You can continue to support the Democrats shift further and further right, but it isn’t winning them any elections, so you’re just handing victories to the Republicans because they already occupy that space. It gave us Trump in 2016, nearly again in 2020, and now again in 2024. It’s also given them the Senate, likely the House, and with the Supreme Court. How much more are you willing to give Republicans before you’re ready to hold the DNC accountable?
Please do explain how losing to a fascist dictator who will end democracy holds Democrats accountable. A token opposition party in Putin-style elections doesn’t need to worry about accountability. Or anything else as long as they don’t defy Great Leader too much.
Other than lots of people suffering and dying and you getting to gloat about it, I’m not seeing the upside here for anyone but Trump supporters.
But I do hope you enjoy the gloating.
ITT there’s a lot of people unwilling to accept the Democrats didn’t prove their case. They didn’t convince the Arabs they would be any better for Palestinians. They didn’t convince unions they would be any better for them. And they certainly didn’t convince anyone leaning truly left to vote for them by seeking Republican endorsements.
Look, I think Harris did the best anyone could with the cards she got dealt. But blaming the voters has never been a winning strategy.
Why does the blame go for Harris for not convincing people when it was clear to anyone paying attention that Trump was going to be worse?
This sounds like how people talk after being obviously wrong and not being able to accept being wrong.
If there are two paths and once says “Doom” and the other says nothing, only a fool picks the marked path. Only a fool who cannot accept responsibility blames the unmarked path for not being clearly marked “NOT Doom”
When one person says they are going to do bad shit, it’s not on the other side to convince you they wont also do bad shit. The person assuming the one not talking who to doing bad shit will do it away because reasons is the problem. There is no one to blame but themselves. They will be a tool until they seize their agency and make an informed decision.
Stop being a tool.
That’s the thing though. In regards to Gaza both paths were marked “Doom”. With regards to the left, courting actual Republicans clearly marked both paths “Conservative”.
Your analogy depends on your point of view being everyone’s point of view. This is a fundamental failing of the democrats this year. They again acted like they were the only obvious choice and nobody could possibly have a legitimate opinion otherwise.
If you ignore voters and let party elders call them Russian agents then it’s not exactly rocket science that they aren’t going to vote for you.
Fine one says “more doom” and the other says “less doom” and you picked more doom because it didn’t quantified how much less.
The point is you picked more doom well. Blaming the signage being inadequate. The sign was clear to anyone that hadn’t shoved their head up their own ass.
You’re still not getting it. You can’t have “just a little” genocide. There is no more or less doom. There is only doom.
You can definitely have a just a little genocide.
You’re inability to comprehend this lead to more genocide. It doesn’t matter if you can see it or accept it; reality doesn’t need you to understand.
Okay. So you don’t understand the word Genocide. Got it.
There were two paths. One path was the dems, who I’ll be the first to admit, not doing a great job with Gaza. The other, was Trump, who is buddies with Israel’s prime minister to a first name basis, moved the embassy to Jerusalem specifically in support for Israel over all others and has proven to have nothing but disdain for anyone else in the region.
I’m sure the people in Gaza hearing the guy who is actively excited about their deaths really appreciate those who didn’t vote “showing the dems” to swap out people at least attempting peace talks.
And frankly not voting to prove a point is like fucking for virginity. All you do is tell the politicians that have an interest against you they don’t have to worry about you, you won’t vote against them either.
None of that makes sense. If the Dems are just greenlighting everything anyways, what’s the point for someone who cares about Gaza?
If the Dems are taking victory laps on a failed economy, what’s the point for a working class family?
If the Dems are actively courting the conservative family members of war criminals who lied to us to kill 4,000 Americans, what’s the point for antiwar activists?
There is not two paths when the Democrats are acting like this.
Dems have been going for peace talks. Again, not great, but bout to find out what greenlighting everything really looks like.
Failed economy, inflation was across the world, the US came out of it better in this administration than the others. Dems were pushing to get money for first time homeowners to try to get houses, get minimum wage raised, and to dial back student loans. The Republican House had blocked every step of the way but the movement went. Instead we got the guy who is buddy buddy and wants to put in the place to deal with government spending the guy who’s a union buster and wants to kill paid overtime.
The conservative family members. I got no answers, like holy shit the worst commendation you can get is from Dick Cheney.
But all of the above is put best “A vote is not a valentine, you’re not professing your love for the candidate. It’s a chess move for the world you want to live in.” Whelp, the move made was to put us into checkmate. Hope you like the Republican ideals, because if MAGAs can be dug out of the other branches of government, if the US continues as it always has and the scales don’t completely fail, we’re still going to have an ultra-conservative Supreme Court for what is likely the rest of our lives.
Going for peace talks? They fully supported Netanyahu’s every move. Biden said the word peace and sent bombs that are literally nicknamed block busters.
If the Republicans are blocking economic reform then that’s the message, not one of victory and whining that people just don’t get it. All the average person heard was how proud Biden was of the economy. Meanwhile the working class is drowning in an affordability crisis.
The chess moves must at least be moving in the correct direction. Or in the Bus analogy, you don’t get on a bus to hell just because they’re both going there.
Whelp, either way, got what you wanted, dems lost. Hope your high minded ideals on sitting aside helps us not be on the bus to hell, because you’re still living here and the consequences aren’t going to walk past you and yours with “Oh, you didn’t vote? A’ight, you get to sit this thing out.”
The people who didn’t vote aren’t dumb. They either don’t believe they’re in an impacted group, or don’t believe the Democrats would be meaningfully better. It’s really that simple.
Take a long look, this is what leftist victories look like
