I am talking about love in the sense of romantic love. I am very short and ugly which makes me very unattractive. Never had a girlfriend or touched a girl. I have many girl friends but one of them was my crush but I never asked her as I knew she would never like me. I know people will say that just get successful and rich and girls will like you, but will they like me or just money. What is the point of dating then. Is there any way I will get genuine love or am I destined to live alone for life.
All the girls say they want a tall guy, I can’t grow my height, trust me I tried, I visited the doctor, I tried exercise, I tried hormones, I tried a special diet that some random YouTuber told me, I tried everything. I can’t become tall for you. I am still thinking about limb lengthening surgery, The doctor said it is very risky and very possible I could never walk, but I want to take every chance possible. Trust me I tried. As soon as I get money I am doing surgery. This was my limit I can’t go beyond that.
Good grooming goes a long way. As does dressing nicely (clean, flattering, well-fitting clothing).
Also keep in mind that what you think is “ugly“ someone else finds attractive.
Seconding good grooming habits and fashion. You don’t have to go crazy spending on this, just stuff that looks nice that fits you well.
People keep saying “looks nice” but I want to be more specific in that different people think different clothes look nice. Some think business casual should be standard unless you are a laborer and prefer those. Some prefer very casual t-shirts and jeans, or sometimes jeans of a specific style, usually as long as they are clean and not stained. There are a ton of different styles you can choose from. I would suggest that overall most people prefer no stains and smelling nice (very light cologne, or even just scented laundry soap), and clothes that are not too big or too small. The area where you live probably has specific taste/style, and you can look at others wear to determine what you think will work for you. You can also try on a bunch of styles and see what feels good and what you think looks good on your body specifically.
I also want to say that, regardless of how you look, try and be a well rounded person. Look for a social group that you enjoy being in, stay in shape, learn to care for yourself and others (like cooking and cleaning, this can go a long way in attractiveness). Although some relationships start by one person they can help the other, either with money or emotional support, those are not often stable nor healthy relationships. If you are in a healthy place by yourself, you can develope better relationships.
That’s great advice. It’s really a good tip to feel okay experimenting with different styles until you find one you like. Finding the confidence to do just that will be a good lesson as well.
For what it’s worth, I get my soaps and colognes from Barrister & Mann. Creating a signature scent can be a lotta fun and I get a lot of compliments on the ones I wear.
Being a well rounded person is also immeasurably good advice. If you want people to be interested in you, you need to be interesting
Also if you’re overweight then losing some will help a lot.
Confidence goes so much further than you imagine. You don’t need to be tall and physically attractive, but you will figure that out. If you think of yourself as unattractive, so will others. I have a gnome-esque friend who embraced his geekiness, found a style that worked for him (outdoorsy/woodsman style) and since then has had plenty of romantic success. If you can have non-romantic relationships, you can also have romantic ones. You really think the only thing preventing them from becoming romantic is the thought ‘if only they were taller /more physically attractive’? You have things to offer, you just need to recognize that fact.
Seconding “confidence”.
I wonder if people have suggested becoming rich/successful because it can build confidence?
Looks and height aren’t as big factors as you think. Anyone who rejects you based on your looks or height was never going to be a good partner regardless of your looks or height. Carry yourself with confidence (fake it til you make it if ya gotta) and you’ll find a lot more success. Also, rejection isn’t life ending. No Means Next. Don’t let it destroy you.
Have some interests and hobbies you genuinely enjoy. Be funny and able to make good conversations. Be a mensch. As you age, as well, that will matter A LOT more in dating than looks or height.
And get off the dating apps. They all suck for everyone.
Also, if you aspire to “improve yourself” to this end, make sure you’re doing it FOR YOURSELF first and foremost. Not for love or sex or dating or any of that. If you put that up on a pedestal as your goal, it’ll make it that much harder to maintain your good habits when things don’t work out as you hope they will. If you want someone to love you, be someone who you love first.
Also also, a lot of this is far easier to say and read than it is to do, and that’s okay. You cannot expect yourself to internalize a new mentality overnight nor is the path to success in any goal a straight line up. It’s okay to do well some days and not well others, remind yourself you’re on an upward trajectory in the long run and that it’s okay to fall back a bit because you’ll bounce back from it in the future.
I am 5’4". I’ve only recently dropped below 200 lbs. I’ve been with my current partner for years and before then I was a fucking SLUT. Don’t be your own enemy in this and you’ll do just fine.
And get off the dating apps. They all suck for everyone.
I still don’t know where I’d find someone not on dating apps, I can only think of clubs or something but I definitely do not enjoy being there
Sorry, but your first paragraph is very flawed
What do you mean?
Don’t feed the troll dude.
I think men can often get stuck in ruts where they become their own worst enemies, especially in dating. They have a plethora of media telling them half truths and skewed perspectives that create a feedback loop of negativity and self-fulfilling prophecy. Fuck, I’d be lying if I said I never had similar thoughts.
Even if OP can’t escape that today and instead posted this to hear answers that affirm this defeatist ideology, other readers may benefit the good advice others have put in this thread.
You first said looks and height are not major factors. Are you not aware how much height is important for girls In dating. Ask any girl what type of guy she wants and tall is always in answer. Height is most important for girls. Now your second sentence is that if someone rejects you for height then they are not good partners, but the guys who are 6ft tall have no problem in dating a girl who says she will never date a guy below 6ft. So this is just a cope saying that if someone rejects you for height they are not good partners. In fact the guys who say that, they will date a girl who says I don’t date below 6ft if they are given chance.
Whatever group online you’re commiserating with about this stuff is wrecking you.
There is no such group
You need to isolate the person in your head telling you this, take them out back and shoot them dead. This is a defeatist attitude and it’s simply hindering you. Not only that, it’s only superficially true. It doesn’t conform with a wider wealth of personal experiences that myself and many others certainly have.
This. This way of thinking is your biggest enemy.
It is not a way of thinking it is just the truth.
Naw dude, it’s manufactured and it’s limiting you. Others may participate in this manufactured concept but its still manufactured. You’re not gonna overcome that until you figure out how to destroy the part of you that believes this.
What is wrong in believing truth
What would you say if I told you there are girls who actually prefer short guys? Hell, some people just like variety–I appreciate tall women, short women, medium women. I like 'em all.
Having said that, I have met the girls you’re referencing. They do exist. A few months back, I went on a coffee date with a girl. Just before it, she made some joke about wanting to make sure I’m tall, because she hates dancing with guys who are shorter than her, so she just wanted to make sure. I wanted to vomit. I very rarely encounter a girl taller than me. I’m ~6’1, maybe pushing a little higher on a good day when my posture is okay. I want nothing to do with a girl who so values my height. Because if it’s THAT important, you’re literally one 6’3 guy away from a relationship crisis. By the way, the reason she was like that? She was taller than average. She was insecure and taking it out on everyone else. But imagine if I’d said to her, “I’m sorry, I just prefer shorter women. I find them more feminine.” Gross. She was surprised when I didn’t bother to hug her or…anything else, really…after coffee. Just got in my car and left. Whether you’re tall or short, that’s a bad match.
There are girls who are like you say, but they are absolutely not all like that. You just need to focus on a better class of prospect.
Where are girls who like short men, I bet you will find them lmao. What are the chances 0.000000001 % or lower
This is what Andrew Tate actually believes.
That asshole is more deserving of age restriction than porn - if you ever hear a nephew bring him up you need to stomp that shit out immediately. What a fucking clown.
Weird, then why did 6’4" me have such a hard time until my late 20s?
As a short dude you couldn’t be more wrong. Get off incel forums and go talk to real people. Just make sure you shower first.
Ohh now I get why I am not getting girls, I never took a shower since birth, thanks for advice man
Yeah I get it. If there’s not attraction, it goes no further.
I’d suggest you get into a venue with more women and ask them (assuming this is the audience you want to woo)
And then second: get out in the real world. Attraction as a filter works on your side IRL. Anyone who keeps talking to you is already past your looks.
Also, have you considered a career that is associated with money?
My crush, who was my friend once openly said to me how she likes tall guys. I was there, she knew I was not tall and she said this in front of me. There was an old survey on Reddit and it proved the same thing that height is most Important for women. And that survey was 7 -8 years old, today’s conditions are even worse.
You’re giving her way too much free real estate in your head. Better to use it as fuel/a chip on your shoulder, if at all.
How can you use it as fuel
Get in good shape, if you’re not already. “I’ll show you what I’m capable of. I’m going to find someone better.” That kind of deal. It works. That’s what I did when what I believed to be the love of my life (she called me her soul mate!) up and married some German douche. While still claiming she loved me, to boot. Better to not focus on people like that, at all, but that’s not always realistic. So if you must feel pain from it, why not decide to make it the pain of self-improvement?
Don’t worry about things you can’t control.
Focus on the things you can control.
Confidence is sexy. Having your life in order is sexy. Having your own life agenda, life activities, life goals is sexy. Physical fitness is good for you. Having a active and full social calendar is good for you. Having hobbies that are interesting is good for you. All of this combined together will give you confidence, and that is sexy!
Don’t maximize your life for other people, do it for yourself, and other people will naturally be intrigued by it.
There’s plenty of ugly people out here fuckin, either groom yourself well and work on your personality or lower your standards.
Wdym by lower you standard
Try your shot at equally as ugly other people, it’s a numbers game
Have you ever talked to ugly girls, even they don’t want to date ugly guys.
And you clearly don’t want to date ugly girls. So much so that your prejudice against them. You are a self-fulfilling prophecy, aren’t you?
I never said I don’t want to date ugly girls
You didn’t say it, but you act like it. By writing them off and saying they don’t want you, you’re implicitly saying you don’t want them.
Also, by saying they don’t want you, you’re protecting yourself from being hurt if they turn you down. That’s a self-defense mechanism.
Reading across your posts, it sounds more and more like you really need to sit down and talk to someone impartial. You seem to have biases that are limiting your ability to be successful.
Maybe not the most helpful answer, but self confidence is a huge part of it. I think that’s why a lot of guys feel like they get more attention when they’re in a relationship compared to when they are looking.
There’s nothing wrong with dipping your feet in the dating pool while you’re working on yourself, but spend some time doing things for yourself, not for other people to like you.
If you’re into music, listen to stuff and play stuff, if you’re into computer games play them and try connecting to people along that avenue. Don’t worry about it you’re hobby is dorky, just worry about if you enjoy it and are happy doing it. That should help develop a sense of identity and purpose separate from what other people think of you.
People are saying being funny and having confidence, and they’re right, and I’m going to tell your why. When being around you makes someone feel good, they will want to be around you more. That’s not exclusive to romantic relationships, it’s true also of friendships and business relationships, too.
An acquaintance asked me out not long ago, I declined. His looks had nothing to do with it, it was his negative personality. The few times I’d talked with him, all he ever did was complain about stuff. Complaints (without solutions) are inherently negative. I don’t need negative energy in my life. A romantic partner has to make life better.
If your expectation is for someone to come and make you happy, then you are a happiness-sink. You drain joy from other people instead of mutually building up each other. No one wants a joy-drain, and I’ll be honest with you, your attitude is one of a drain.
So, the question is, how do you make a someone’s life better? Do you being laughter to her? Do you make her feel safe? Do you give her confidence in herself? Do you bring interest to her life? Do you make her feel heard and seen? And to be clear, someone should do all those things for you mutually, too. Two people should be building each other up.
The last guy I wanted to ask out (but he abruptly lost his job and had to move to another city, so I never did) he was in his late 20s and already balding quit a bit, lanky, and has terrible posture. Physically, he not very attractive. But not only was he very funny (a good start), he was also doing his masters (intelligent and hard working), played musical instruments (passion and interest), and spent a lot of time volunteering (kind and caring). Everything about his personality drew new to him. (And honestly, next to that, what positive would I have brought to him?)
One thing’s for sure - reducing women to nothing but shallow height obsessed monsters (projecting your own insecurities on to a whole gender, the individuals of which you know nothing about, and worse - aren’t interested in finding out) isn’t it.
What will make you attractive to women? Stop acting like a victim - there are plenty of short and ugly guys in healthy loving relationships, your external body isn’t why you’re not in a relationship, also, you are not owed or entitled to a relationship. Quit the toxic manosphere and any other space that confirms this bullshit bias for you cold turkey and never look back. If you can afford to, get therapy. Work on becoming a person other people would actually want to be around, rather than a stereotypical incel (you might not think of yourself as one, but you absolutely come across as one).
You’re clearly not interested in hearing any of this, but that is the truth, not this red/black pill bullshit you’re regurgitating.
You need to go reread what he said. No where did he even imply what you said.
I never said girls are bad or monsters, stop making stuff by yourself, be humble and listen to other people first
be humble and listen to other people first
Lmmfao, says the person rejecting every single piece of advice being given to them… 🤣
(hint: you don’t have to explicitly use a word for the implication to be oozing from your post. also - W O M E N. The fact that you can’t even use the word doesn’t help your point)
E: also, I absolutely love the fact that you took offence to me using the word “monsters” (because acknowledging that that’s how you see women is acknowledging that women, and their rejection, scare you) but not to me calling you an incel. That’s your answer right there, if only you were capable of seeing past your cognitive dissonance…
Personally, I like to use the term lllllladies with plenty of L’s so they know I’m looking for love.
For extra emphasis walk in to the beat of that beastie boys track - the velour track suit is optional but the attitude isn’t.
Well for starters your assessment of your own attractiveness might be overstated, it’s also possible that it’s accentuated by poor grooming, fashion, or fitness standards.
So let’s assume you just have an unattractive face, full stop. Do you have a patchy beard? Maybe keep it only in areas where you grow hair more fully like a goatee, or clean shave if you don’t have any areas where it grows well. Make sure your hairstyle fits the shape of your face, if you have a longer more oval-like shape a fade on the sides and longer on top works well. If you have a round face then longer hair usually pairs well with that as it helps even out the width.
Physically you’ll need to be in better shape than most, if just to keep up. You don’t need to be a body builder necessarily, but having muscle and a beer gut looks better than being “skinny-fat” as they say. A lot of the stigma around short guys surrounds us not being as capable of defending ourselves and our families due to size, but anyone who’s ever been in martial arts can tell you weight is more important than height, and while height can allow higher weight capacity, not every tall guy gets shredded. Being bigger will help offset that stigma, the worst thing a short guy can be is scrawny.
Also important is personal hygiene, I’ve always been complimented on this especially when getting head, and believe me it’s the quickest way to show someone you have attention to detail. If you can get and afford baby wipes they make a great finisher so you can actually get clean after going to the bathroom, and take showers regularly.
Now this last part is the hardest since it has no tangible existence that can be measured, but you have to accept a couple of truths. Keep in mind when I say these things that I myself am 5’4-5’5" depending on time of day so I’m not some 6’ chad giving you useless info. I have LIVED this for a large part of my existence.
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Everyone has preferences, and it’s OK that some women need their guy to be taller than them. It sucks, but no matter who you are there’s a guarantee you won’t be everyone’s cup of tea and that’s just life.
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Think of these preferences as a filter, the women that care aren’t your dating target anyways. Find the ones that don’t seem to mind and focus on those.
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Even the women that don’t mind WILL be turned off the more you harp on how being a short guy is the cause of all your problems. You must be the bigger man when it comes to this, if you get made fun of find a way to respond that doesn’t show you’re insecure about it even if you are, but getting angry is the one thing you absolutely cannot do. It’s literally the goal of people who ridicule you to make you angry so they can point and go “look at the pissed off short guy he’s such a stereotype.” You have to rise above this in social situations until the person making fun of you for it is seen as the weird one for focusing on it so much. It’s the only way to win. Either way you have to reframe the way you see yourself so that you’re not a victim. It’s the most difficult part of the mental hurdle to overcome but you’ll not see success until you do.
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Fuck off. You’re perfect as you are and if you managed to “land” a partner in spite of their revulsion to your appearance you’d be fucking miserable. Find a partner based on shared interests and don’t obsess about appearance, that shit is unimportant.
Just date short and ugly girls
Even they think they deserve a tall guy for some reason . Ever noticed that short girls are more height obsessed.
Short and hot girls might be height obsessed, but short ugly girls probably aren’t
You don’t know young girls much, am I right?
To what end?
Many people view “looks” with a strong filter of personality. So being active, funny, nice, kind, etc. would actually, really, make you look more attractive to people.
Dress well, stay clean, get fit, improve yourself as much as possible. But do these things to make yourself a better person, not with an ulterior motive.
If you want this, do that.
But don’t do that because you want this.Self improvement to realize an idealized self is it’s own reward. In doing so, you become more attractive to people in a natural way. It’s not contradictory. Chasing self improvement as a vehicle to love or sex has the pitfall of losing your motivation for self improvement when you suffer rejection, but rejection is normal, common, and not as big a deal as it can sometimes feel.
If you want this, do that.
But don’t do that only because you want this.It’s still pretty contradictory.
I think it’s just one of the necessary contradictions/lies that society requires to function.
First of all, it’s very common for a woman to say they like tall guys. Just like most guys would say they like girls with big breasts. But at the end of the day no one can get their ideal person. It’s either looks or personality. Everyone has to compromise.
But if your crush is obsessed with height then she’s a dispecable human being who doesn’t deserve anyone’s attention or love. If it’s any consolation there are a lot of tall fuck boys that will use and dump those kind of height obsessed women. And those guys will only pick the best of the best for romantic partners. All other women will be devoid of happiness and forever keep on searching. So scratch all women like that off your list!!
Now, you mentioned money to get attention of women. Although that would work to some extent, most of the attention you’d get would be from gold diggers. They are experts of manipulation and gaslighting, they would take all your money and will leave you in a worse mental situation than before. And no, it’s not that easy to spot a golddigger. Again, they are experts in their craft.
But there are some things you can do:
- As others mentioned, grooming and looking your best. I won’t go into depth here.
- Being funny. Women really are more inclined to like a guy that makes them laugh. The trick is to find the right amount of funny. You shouldn’t be a clown. Smart and a bit of sarcastic goes a long way. If you can also be able to make fun of yourself (a healthy amount) that will also show confidence. And confidence is always a winning feat.
- Success / Passion. One of the reasons (besides golddiggers) that women like men with money is that it’s a form of being successful. Be passionate about something and try to be good at it. Creative endeavors like art and music will attract a lot of attention. Make you more interesting. Yes, that won’t help out with all women but quite a sizeable amount of women. Also keep in mind that to some level everyone likes to show off their partners. A tall but boring accountant wouldn’t be as good as a partner than a short king who creates art, puts up exhibitions, being passionate about his subject, fun to talk to.
I literally never heard a guy saying I will never date a girl who doesn’t have boobs big enough or if she is not above B or C something like that
And I have literally never heard a girl in real life say she wouldn’t date a guy if he’s not above 6 ft. I see guys say it about women, but none of the women I know actually care about height. I have heard women say they’d prefer if their partner is taller than them, but even this is a preference, not a deal breaker. If you’ve actually heard the height thing from real women in your life, you just need to start hanging out with different women because that’s a shallow requirement.
There really isn’t such a thing as ugly in an objective sense. Certainly some people have looks that will appeal to more people, but there are a lot of people out there who have unusual taste in terms of what they find attractive. There are girls out there who are into skinny guys, fat guys, short guys, hairy guys, guys with weird facial features, etc.
Some women don’t care that much about looks and are more interested in personality traits anyway. The looks just need to pass a minimum threshold for them and then they’ll care more about what you’re like as a person.
You’re not ugly, you’re just a niche. I’m saying this as someone who is thus far in the same situation you’re in (28M, haven’t ever kissed or anything with a woman), but I recently started dating someone, and it’s always a shock to me when she honestly tells me she thinks I’m cute.
Money and personality. The money is optional.
There is someone out there that finds you attractive and wants a life with you, in all likelihood there is more than just that one person. Don’t expect to land a supermodel, but treat every girl that shares a bed with you as the perfect 10 that she is.
