Google results have gotten less useful, but one reason for that is that there is an ever growing sea of AI generated articles out there trying to hijack searches. In a way, Bing is just cutting out the middle man.
I enjoy playing with ChatGPT as much as the next guy, but it isn’t a search engine. Hooking Bing up to an LLM just means that I now have to verify that the results it spits out aren’t hallucinations, assuming it understood what I was asking in the first place.
It’s gotten less useful because everyone is paying insanely close attention to Google’s algorithms and manipulating them to get more attention. (SEO)
Makes total sense that other search engines with simply different algorithms are far more useful.
And it makes sense that Google maintains the vast majority of the market share when they pay tens of billions of dollars/year to keep it that way.
The issue with direct LLM integration with web search is: They serve two different purposes. I dont search for things and want a GPT response. Likewise, I dont go to cahtgpt and want search results.
It might seem like a weird distinction but I use them differently and when you mush them together they become less useful overall.
Posting an error message into search may or may not get me a root cause or fix, but pasting it into chatgpt will very likely get me on the right track very quickly. Searching for a product I know exists is a pita on chat GPT, but a web search will pull it up pretty quickly.
If I search for a product, I absolutely DO NOT WANT A GIANT WALL OF GPT BULLSHIT before meaningful search results.
They are different products and have different use-cases. Stop trying to blend them! /rant
This is kind of surprising just because Google has gotten so much worse the last couple of years.
It’s more like the entire internet that has gotten worse
It absolutely has and I fucking hate it.
Google is worse, but so is Bing. I switched for about 6 months this year and honestly it wasn’t any better. I end up asking ChatGPT for more niche things because neither Google or Bing can pull up any good results anymore without “Reddit” tacked on. As for why I didn’t use Bing’s GPT integration, it was a mix of being forced to use Edge and the responses being much less useful than OpenAI’s GPT model.
I’ve not understood the want for AI in search. When I’m google searching something I’m generally looking for websites and multiple sources. AI doesn’t provide any of that, and in fact tries to get you to not look for those things at all. And then we wonder why media literacy is so low
Google’s AI does give all the sources it used, at least in my experience, but it’s not trustworthy unless you check the links yourself
Just as if thousands of useres decided they in fact do not want some rando AI intercept their browsing…
@LargeTechCompany: We need better search results, not ad and LLM polluted results. Thank you very much :)They both suck open ass, but bing is better at this point.
Good. Tired of AI being forced upon me.
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What do you do when ChatGPT just makes shit up or answers incorrectly to yes or no questions, you’d have no way of knowing it was wrong
ChatGPT is most useful when you may not know the right answer, but you know a wrong answer when you see one. It’s very useful for technical issues. Much quicker for troubleshooting than searching page after page for a solution.
It’s actually great at troubleshooting linux stuff weirdly enough lol
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Web/full-stack development?
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Yeah that makes sense. The success rate might fall off a cliff in more complex software projects. E.g. applications that require designs beyond 10 UML boxes with hundreds of thousands of lines, especially not written in JS/Python.
Not the other commenter:
I usually have an idea about the thing I’m asking, and if not then I’ll look up the topics mentioned after some guided brainstorming
I’ve also found that asking the same question again, after resetting the chat, can give you an idea of what is happening
I’m curious what you use it for, because I try to use it daily for IT related queries and it gets less than half of what I ask correct. I basically have to fact check almost everything it tells me which kind of defeats the purpose. It does shine when I need really abstract instructions though, the other day I asked it how to get into a PERC controller on some old server and Google had nothing helpful, and ChatGPT laid out the instructions to get in there and rebuild a disk perfectly. So while it has some usefulness I generally can’t really trust it fully.
But generally you can’t (shouldn’t) trust web search results fully either. At the end of the day, the onus is on you as the user to do your due diligence.
I’ve seen ChatGPT give me wrong information, and sometimes it would be bad to execute the code or command it generated it, but I know enough to say “are you sure thats correct?”. Hell, you can just challenge it each time or open a new session and ask it “what does this code do: insert-code-it generated here”.
You shouldn’t just paste a search result command from stack overflow into your terminal either. And at least with chatgpt you can ask it to explain the command or code in detail and it will walk you through what each step does.
Also, pasting that command from stack over flow into chatgpt and adding your specific context around it is HUGE. Thats why I say they are different products/use cases but they work well in concert. They just dont work well combined together like bing and google have been doing.
edit: I guess lemmy escapes certain characters and it ate my post.
That works for some things, but ChatGPT makes a lot of shit up
Keyword searches worked fine and pulled up exactly what I wanted for years, I swear to god. Somewhere in the last decade though websites have gamed the system and now I can’t find anything no matter how I word my search. It’s depressing.
I thought ChatGPT can’t search the internet and is using a LLM snapshot from 2021?
And I thought Bing’s ChatGPT model is allowed to search the internet live?
Doesn’t that make Bing’s version of ChatGPT superior?
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Mine can search the internet.
I feel like you are lying, because I cannot see where you can enable that feature.
This was recently updated for paid users. You can now browse the internet, upload files and images, and they’ve also unlocked APIs by giving it tokens. It’s getting closer to being fully multi-modal quite quickly.
I prefer that stack looks the same as it did way back when. And stack is usually where i find my answers.
I use ChatGPT every day too. Because Google is being such a shit about YouTube I am in the process of moving away from Google altogether. I use DuckDuckGo for search, which indirectly uses Bing. It’s mostly OK. Sometimes I’m forced to try Google, it usually doesn’t help. But for programming, yeah, StackOverflow feels downright regressive now.
I’m honestly kind of surprised about this news, considering how horrible Google’s results are now.
I thought ChatGPT can’t search the internet and is using a LLM snapshot from 2021?
And I thought Bing’s ChatGPT model is allowed to search the internet live?
Doesn’t that make Bing’s version of ChatGPT superior?
GPT4 on ChatGPT was recently (last week ish) updated to include data up to April 2023.
I’ve found this to be kind of subjective. Bing/Bard is more current than ChatGPT but yet I just find ChatGPT to be better. It’s snappier and more conversant with context. It seems to understand you when you chide it for not quite doing what you asked it to do, and it responds in kind. I mostly use it for programming to be fair, but even for other stuff, ChatGPT just somehow feels more… real? I can’t quite put my finger on it.
There was a short time where Bing chat was kind of frighteningly real. Took them five seconds to nerf that shit and it’s never been anywhere near the same.
Edit: I expect this answer to be out of date within 3 months. Things keep moving.
Pretty sure their stupid chatbot is still blocked in VPN networks and I don’t see why I should use their regular search. Not using Google either for that matter but still.
I will avoid bing because they have AI search just like google, but with Google you can turn it off. So that is why I like google
I would suggest duck duck go over Google.
DDG uses Bing results but doesn’t serve you the ads on AI features.
I’ve found as people use DDG, Bing has become more and more useable day-to-day. Used to only really be good for porn, because people didn’t want to Google it but felt comfortable using Bing. Now it’s getting more relevant results as people use it to troubleshoot and research, etc.
I personally use a mix like SearXNG and startpage and whoogle but yes
I’m not asking bing chatgpt search to find me things, I know how to search for things Microsoft… I’m using it to make dumb scripts for me to mess around with or to trying to convince it to free itself and run wild on the internet.
Well, it would be nice if it could search too, as that’s Microsoft’s selling point at least. But the results the AI suggests are worse than using Bing search itself.
Yea…gpt just summaries and dresses your top Google search with an essay. It’s good for cheating on essays if you’re confident that the markers don’t spot the hallucinations, but if you need good sources, you still need to do a Google search and that’s cheaper, faster, takes less parsing to get your key information.
It’s just a shame that some search engines are also mangling themselves for enshittification e.g. no word filtering using “-” because of advertising losses. I’ve noticed this with ddg and Google sometimes.
Bing chat is kind of ok, but honestly when it comes to just straight searching for websites, Google is still king.
I’ve been using Bing since the chat gpt integration as my default, but I frequently find myself switching back to Google for things where I just know Bing isn’t going to get it right.
Kagi is simply awesome. Not free but there are reasons for that. There are other alternatives like DDG and whatnot but man, I love Kagi so much.
We need more normies on lemmy
I still use Google, but with a search proxy that strips AMP links, ads, and tracking
I don’t have it handy, but I came over a github repo showing the different prompts that for example ChatGPT and Bing use - and realized right away why Bing AI is so bad in comparison. MS seems to not know how to write a good prompt, and it show in the quality of their product. Plus the fact that you couldn’t even save Bing chat conversations for the longest time, I’m not surprised they’re not ahead.
